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    Sunnies and Shiites at it again.

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    papa_umau
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    Sunnies and Shiites at it again.

    Post by papa_umau on Mon 04 Jan 2016, 1:05 pm

    Iran supreme leader says Saudi faces 'divine revenge'

    Iran's supreme leader says Saudi Arabia will face "divine revenge" for executing a top Shia cleric, as 40 arrested for storming Saudi embassy in Tehran.

    Saudi Arabia executed Sheikh Nimr al-Nimr alongside 46 others including dozens of al-Qaeda members, in the country's biggest mass execution in three decades.

    The full story and a video from The Telegraph can be found HERE




    Many will not realise that this is in fact a Sunny Muslim and a Shia Muslim fight as many Saudis are Islamic Sunnies and Iran is virtually all Islamic Shiites.

    These groups of subdivisions of the Islamic faith have been trying to inflict genocide on each other for hundreds of years.

    I say that if the Islamic faith can not sort itself out peacefully then we who lean towards Christianity and even the Jewish Faith in Britain have no chance of talking down the terrorists with religious arguments.

    Opinion anybody ?


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    zathrus
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    Re: Sunnies and Shiites at it again.

    Post by zathrus on Thu 07 Jan 2016, 12:53 pm

    This should never be left to the religions to sort out as all of them have some axe to grind.

    If the middle ground religious followers were to stand up and be counted instead of just hiding behind the robes of their leaders then the extremists might be left with nowhere to go.
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    Re: Sunnies and Shiites at it again.

    Post by papa_umau on Fri 08 Jan 2016, 12:52 pm

    Just out of interest HERE is a simple explanation why the Muslim Sunni and Shia hatred should be so profound.

    The schism, as it has been called, goes back to the split between Sunni and Shia caused by the death of the Prophet Muhammed in 632 CE.

    It was about the succession. Some Muslims were democratic in their approach and thought the leader of Islam should be elected from among the learned and devout. They chose Abu Bakr, a close friend and companion of the Prophet, who became first Caliph, secular leader of the Islamic nation.

    His followers claimed the title of "Sunni," or followers of the tradition of the Prophet.

    The rest of this view by the learned members of The Panopticon can be found in the link supplied.




    SO... I guess the bloodshed seen between the Sunni and Shia sectors of Islam is not our fault after all.


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    Re: Sunnies and Shiites at it again.

    Post by Angie baby on Sat 09 Jan 2016, 12:41 pm

    That's interesting Papa.

    I did not know that these two sections of the Muslim faith hated each other as much as it appears they do.

    Mind you, I don't think it is a bad thing that they spend their time making war on each other, as if they do they won't be turning their attentions to us so readily.
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    Re: Sunnies and Shiites at it again.

    Post by papa_umau on Sun 10 Jan 2016, 1:03 pm

    Sadly, my dear this ingrained hatred between the Sunni and the Shia groups will not have any effect on what the extremists in The Taliban, Boko Haram and Isil etc' are doing in their Jihad against what they see as the unbelievers in Europe and The West.


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    Post by Nuthin fancy on Sun 10 Jan 2016, 8:01 pm

    Hi all,

    Don't know what to say on this. There will always be conflict. I did not have a clue about all these factions until I ended up working abroad in Pakistan ( over 20 years ago now ). I learned pretty quickly about Islam, and learned to keep my mouth shut as a worker and guest in that country.

    Of course I was working at the time in The Aga Khan University ( Karachi) with a bunch of Yanks and Canadians, and guess what.... the First Gullf War started!!!. They all bu**ered off pretty damn quick which left me in a limbo and I managed to get on a (military !! ) flight back to the UK...So that messed up the job somewhat.

    Now the point is they were in my opinion living in the middel ages then, and I am pretty sure with the continued wars that has not changed. Zath is right, we should not be getting involved. If they want to hack bits from each other let them get on with it....Pakistan in particular is such a hot bed of extremism its just too dangerous these days to contemplate visitng unless you have an AK47 and bullet proof vest!!!

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    Re: Sunnies and Shiites at it again.

    Post by papa_umau on Mon 11 Jan 2016, 12:29 pm

    Yes, although this hatred between the Sunni and Shia subdivisions in Islam has it's roots way back in the days of the formation of the Islamic religion, the arguments about who should be the leader between the Sunnis and the Shiites is just as hot and full of hatred now as it was back then.

    Because of this severe stance we are seeing something akin to war starting between Saudi Arabia and Iran.

    This could be the start of a middle East war that could spread all across the Islamicist states which could drag many other allies into the fight.

    It might be interesting to note that the final armageddon holocaust mentioned in the book of Revelation of the old testament of the Christian bible was set in the middle East.


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    Sunni and Shiites

    Post by Nuthin fancy on Mon 11 Jan 2016, 1:07 pm

    Hi all,

    That's a good response Paps, and I too have thought of that Armageddon scenario!!.

    I have a good mate who is a Baptist Minister that thinks all this talk about the final days is a load of tosh, as he says it comes from the very influential and very RICH Southern Baptists in the USA. I don't know though. I am not into organised religion in any wasy but it makes you think; and you are correct to link the Middle East scenarios to a possible future war. Its a right powder keg and wants watching with great care!!

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    Re: Sunnies and Shiites at it again.

    Post by papa_umau on Tue 12 Jan 2016, 12:24 pm

    I am inclined to lean towards the Kenny Everett solution here so long as it does not overflow into Europe, Asia and North Africa as the solution to "round em all up, pud em in a field and BOMB the bastards" seems like the way to go.



    The great problem here is that what happens in the Middle East one day very quickly becomes our problem soon afterwards.


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    Re: Sunnies and Shiites at it again.

    Post by Hell's Granny on Wed 13 Jan 2016, 11:54 am

    It is a difficult problem. Islam is in it's Crusading and Inquisition phase at present; All the religions of The Book have gone though it in their pasts.

    Shia and Sunni equate to Catholics and Anglicans, and the Jews have Sephardi and Ashkenazi. All have fought over who is right for hundreds and in some cases, thousands of years. All have forced conversions, and all have slaughtered apostates.

    What really makes me laugh is that all three religions are fighting over the same God, just under different names.

    Religion is bad enough, but when mixed with politics it gets really evil.

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    Re: Sunnies and Shiites at it again.

    Post by papa_umau on Thu 14 Jan 2016, 12:46 pm

    I could not agree more HG.

    What is a surprise to me is that even although these religions all believe in the same God, they can spend a lot of their religious minutes ripping at each-other's throats.

    If the great religions of the world cannot live with each other what chance is there for people of different religions to get along.

    Of course, as you will probably already know that I am a staunch, ( if I can use that word ), altheist I find it great to be able to look in from outside so that I can examine the theisms without getting caught up in their baggage.

    I think that the religions are now becoming afraid that world secular values are seriously diminishing their congregations.


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    Re: Sunnies and Shiites at it again.

    Post by Hell's Granny on Fri 15 Jan 2016, 11:21 am

    I'm a Godless Pagan! Laughing
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    Re: Sunnies and Shiites at it again.

    Post by papa_umau on Sat 16 Jan 2016, 1:07 pm

    That's a great word HG. "Pagan" I mean, as the word has many connotations of religion or of no religion at all.

    Here is a quote from GotQuestions.org

    Question: "What is a pagan? What is paganism?"

    Answer: From a Christian viewpoint, pagans are generally characterized as those who are caught up in any religious ceremony, act, or practice that is not distinctly Christian. Correspondingly, Jews and Muslims also use the term pagans to describe those outside their religion. Others define the term paganism as any religion outside of Buddhism, Hinduism, Judaism, and Christianity; whereas some argue that a pagan is anyone with no religion at all.




    Maybe Pagans just don't like being tied down to any one religion eh ? Suspect

    I find it better and with greater ease of mind to not have anything to do with any of the world's religions. Twisted Evil


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    Re: Sunnies and Shiites at it again.

    Post by Hell's Granny on Wed 27 Jan 2016, 3:57 pm

    I have to admit to being a Druid. I am a Celt, mainly Breton, Welsh and Cornish, although there is a little Irish and Scots as well. I guess I'm a Celtic mongrel!

    I enjoy studying the belief systems of other people and their cultures.
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    Re: Sunnies and Shiites at it again.

    Post by papa_umau on Thu 28 Jan 2016, 1:06 pm

    Nothing whatsoever wrong about being a religious "mongrel" HG as that shows that you are not too weak to get caught by any one religious force.

    I too enjoy studying the religious belief-systems of other cultures, I just do not want to subscribe to any of them.


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