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    Europe verses the UK, re- State pensions. Please sign my Petition.

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    Parliament....
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    Europe verses the UK, re- State pensions. Please sign my Petition.

    Post by Parliament.... on Fri 07 Jun 2013, 3:24 pm

    Europe looks after its pensioners and future generations of pensioners, namely it's young people. The working populace of Europe pay higher rates of income tax and NI contributions.

    Please read the following.

    At the Laeken EU summit in 2001 there was a ratified proposal that all member states should endeavour to attain a level of 40% of their median wages as their basic state pension by 2007 and thereafter work towards 60%. This is how we did in 2007:


    STATE PENSION AS A PROPORTION OF AVERAGE WAGE 2007
    COUNTRY % OF AV EARNINGS
    Greece 95.7
    Luxemburg 88.3
    Netherlands 81.9
    Spain 81.2
    Denmark 79.8
    Italy 67.9
    Sweden 62.1
    EU AVERAGE 60%
    France 51.2
    Germany 39.9
    Estonia 32.9
    Ireland 32.5
    UK 30.8
    As I'm sure you know, 60% of median wages is the poverty level. Not very good progress, is it? ...I would be grateful for your signature and any comments you would care to make.

    UK state pensions scandal. UK pensioners at the bottom of EU league in 2001, still the same in 2007, and what about in 2013?

    http://epetitions.direct.gov.uk/petitions/51449

    Please sign this petition to show your disgust at this disgraceful situation.

    Ivanhoe




    Last edited by Ivanhoe on Tue 11 Jun 2013, 2:37 pm; edited 1 time in total
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    papa_umau
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    Re: Europe verses the UK, re- State pensions. Please sign my Petition.

    Post by papa_umau on Sat 08 Jun 2013, 10:46 am

    Yes, I guess that most of already know that the state pension in Britain is well down on the general levels in many European states.

    While on the face of it this certainly sounds as if we pensioners in Britain are below the poverty levels, we have to compare like for like and if we do we find that almost all of the states that have higher state pensions also have much higher direct taxes.

    Of course this is no excuse for not paying the British pensioners a living pension, as to be able to find the right level we just have to ensure that the pensions paid are equated with the AVERAGE wage and not the MEDIAN wage.

    Government after British government have refused to do this as in their eyes they do not have the money to raise the state pension to the level it should be at for it to be a civilised and a humane one.


    _________________
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    Papa......


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    Angie baby
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    Re: Europe verses the UK, re- State pensions. Please sign my Petition.

    Post by Angie baby on Sat 08 Jun 2013, 11:01 am

    To me, who is not a pensioner YET, I think that if the will was there to pay a decent state pension they should be able to find the money easily. It is just about prioritising.

    I guess that how the pensioners live in Britain is just not a high enough priority, especially for the Tories.

    When I see what my old mum has to live on I get angry and try to help her as much as I can, but that situation should never come about in any civilised and modern country.

    I really hope that the Tories and their Lib-Dem buddies suffer ignominious defeat at the next election as that is all they deserve.

    Parliament....
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    Re: Europe verses the UK, re- State pensions. Please sign my Petition.

    Post by Parliament.... on Sat 08 Jun 2013, 1:03 pm

    Angie baby wrote:To me, who is not a pensioner YET, I think that if the will was there to pay a decent state pension they should be able to find the money easily. It is just about prioritising.

    I guess that how the pensioners live in Britain is just not a high enough priority, especially for the Tories.

    When I see what my old mum has to live on I get angry and try to help her as much as I can, but that situation should never come about in any civilised and modern country.

    I really hope that the Tories and their Lib-Dem buddies suffer ignominious defeat at the next election as that is all they deserve.

    Angie-baby, the State pensions link with male average earnings, or inflation, to protect the State pensions value, has never been reversed, since Thatcher cut the earnings link in 1980.

    And I cannot see Milliband's Labour Government going back to what was set up by Harold Wilson and Barbara Castle in 1974-76.

    Even the new pensions proposals coming in after the next general election keeps existing pensioners to means testing, while tomorrows pensioners, ie the youth of today will receive a State pension based on 40 years I believe of NI contributions, 144 a week. However with so much unemployment about today, millions will be in the gutter methinks. I dont know how long the unemployed will have their stamp paid.

    Ivanhoe

    Parliament....
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    Re: Europe verses the UK, re- State pensions. Please sign my Petition.

    Post by Parliament.... on Sat 08 Jun 2013, 1:24 pm

    papa_umau wrote:Yes, I guess that most of already know that the state pension in Britain is well down on the general levels in many European states.

    While on the face of it this certainly sounds as if we pensioners in Britain are below the poverty levels, we have to compare like for like and if we do we find that almost all of the states that have higher state pensions also have much higher direct taxes.

    Of course this is no excuse for not paying the British pensioners a living pension, as to be able to find the right level we just have to ensure that the pensions paid are equated with the AVERAGE wage and not the MEDIAN wage.

    Government after British government have refused to do this as in their eyes they do not have the money to raise the state pension to the level it should be at for it to be a civilised and a humane one.

    ""Of course this is no excuse for not paying the British pensioners a living pension, as to be able to find the right level we just have to ensure that the pensions paid are equated with the AVERAGE wage and not the MEDIAN wage"".

    No Papa, the EU MEDIAN wage is right and proper. But sadly this isnt going to be, because Tony Blair during his Presidency of the EU in 2005, secured three red lines. One was that British pensioners would not receive the much higher State pensions EU pensioners receive.

    Ivanhoe
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    papa_umau
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    Re: Europe verses the UK, re- State pensions. Please sign my Petition.

    Post by papa_umau on Sun 09 Jun 2013, 11:46 am

    Am I right that you just said:

    "As I'm sure you know, 60% of median wages is the poverty level. Not very good progress, is it? I would be grateful for your comments." ?

    What I am in fact doing is agreeing with you that if we here in Britain were to get 60% of average earnings as a state pension we would consider ourselves to be very well off.

    You are looking for argument where there is none.


    _________________
    Best of regards

    Papa......



    Parliament....
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    Number of posts : 1623
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    Re: Europe verses the UK, re- State pensions. Please sign my Petition.

    Post by Parliament.... on Tue 11 Jun 2013, 2:33 pm

    Ivanhoe wrote:Europe looks after its pensioners and future generations of pensioners, namely it's young people. The working populace of Europe pay higher rates of income tax and NI contributions.

    Please read the following.

    At the Laeken EU summit in 2001 there was a ratified proposal that all member states should endeavour to attain a level of 40% of their median wages as their basic state pension by 2007 and thereafter work towards 60%. This is how we did in 2007:


    STATE PENSION AS A PROPORTION OF AVERAGE WAGE 2007
    COUNTRY % OF AV EARNINGS
    Greece 95.7
    Luxemburg 88.3
    Netherlands 81.9
    Spain 81.2
    Denmark 79.8
    Italy 67.9
    Sweden 62.1
    EU AVERAGE 60%
    France 51.2
    Germany 39.9
    Estonia 32.9
    Ireland 32.5
    UK 30.8
    As I'm sure you know, 60% of median wages is the poverty level. Not very good progress, is it? I would be grateful for your comments.

    Ivanhoe

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    papa_umau
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    Number of posts : 12447
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    Re: Europe verses the UK, re- State pensions. Please sign my Petition.

    Post by papa_umau on Wed 12 Jun 2013, 10:56 am

    In fact Osborne has re-made this connection for the state pension and the average wage !

    Here is an extract from The Guardian that reports this:

    "The link between the state pension and earnings, scrapped by Margaret Thatcher, will be restored in what the chancellor offered as evidence that the coalition is a "progressive alliance".


    Read more about this HERE


    _________________
    Best of regards

    Papa......



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