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    Rail prices rise by more than fifty percent.

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    papa_umau
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    Rail prices rise by more than fifty percent.

    Post by papa_umau on Sun 30 Dec 2012, 1:18 pm

    Read about this from the Sunday Times online HERE

    Rail campaigners attack New Year inflation-busting fares rise

    Railfuture claims that there has been "no perceptible improvement in service" despite prices rising by more than half over last decade

    The average season ticket increase of 4.2%, which triggers on Wednesday, is the tenth above-inflation increase in a row, said Railfuture.




    So, were we not expecting cheaper and better rail services after they were all privatised ?

    Now we see what happens to us when these privatised TOCS are allowed by government to keep raising their prices without providing better services for the higher cost.

    What is worse is that all of these services are STILL heavily subsidised from taxpayers cash.

    If you want to know exactly how much these privatised services are now subsidised by read THIS.


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    bowsertoad
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    Re: Rail prices rise by more than fifty percent.

    Post by bowsertoad on Mon 31 Dec 2012, 12:29 pm

    Rail prices have increased so much since i moved to yorkshire. I moved to sheffield in 2007, a train to wellingborough from sheffield (as it is the only direct route to northamptonshire) cost 25.60 return. I travelled back to the shire this christmas, and the ticket cost 36.80.

    I know what your think, time of the year, but this is the same as price as october 2012. So in a period of 5 years the same journey has gone up 11+. This is ridiculous.
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    papa_umau
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    Re: Rail prices rise by more than fifty percent.

    Post by papa_umau on Mon 31 Dec 2012, 12:52 pm

    Yes Bowsie, and if you were buying a season-ticket for daily commuting into London from the "'burbs" your annual ticket would cost around three thousand pounds.

    HERE is a news item from the Bracknell News about this.

    The main headline was:

    "The cost of an annual season ticket from Bracknell to London Waterloo on South West Trains is set to rise from 3,160 to 3,292 from Wednesday, January 2. It comes after a 6.2% rail increase last year. A season ticket from Wokingham to Waterloo will cost 3,392, up from 3,256. The 4.1% increase compares with the national inflation rate of 2.7%"

    Now, I agree, that that is SERIOUSLY "ridiculous".


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    bowsertoad
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    Re: Rail prices rise by more than fifty percent.

    Post by bowsertoad on Mon 31 Dec 2012, 1:25 pm

    The thing that gets me is the government, no matter the colour of the banner have always banged on abou t getting people onto public transport, with the increase of pricing, it is cheaper to run a car.
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    zathrus
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    Re: Rail prices rise by more than fifty percent.

    Post by zathrus on Mon 31 Dec 2012, 1:55 pm

    Well said Bowsertoad.

    I too think it is ridiculous that any government might go on about getting people off the roads and onto public transport and yet they allow the private bus and train companies to charge what they like.

    "Public transport", as they like to call it, should be cheap and efficient if they want us to use it more and the road less, but we all know that every time these fares go up more and more people are forced right back into their cars.

    That news-quote about the cost of season tickets into London is a shocker Paps.

    I am just going to have to keep using my dirty old diesel van until it blows up one day.
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    bowsertoad
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    Re: Rail prices rise by more than fifty percent.

    Post by bowsertoad on Mon 31 Dec 2012, 2:15 pm

    I havce no complaints to be honest about the bus system in sheffield, like all towns we have the big two, but the council have not split the town in half, instead they have both companies running the same routes, to make sure that they do not monopolise certain routes, this gave us about 12 momnths of fluxuating prices, but both first and Stagecoach are the same cost now for a single journey, daily or weekly, which for me is good thing.
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    zathrus
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    Re: Rail prices rise by more than fifty percent.

    Post by zathrus on Mon 31 Dec 2012, 2:37 pm

    The thing is though; what kind of people actually use the buses ?

    I will tell you shall I. It is the people that cannot afford to own or run a car that use the buses.

    How many people with money actually use the buses ? Not many, if any, I might suggest.
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    Re: Rail prices rise by more than fifty percent.

    Post by bowsertoad on Mon 31 Dec 2012, 2:46 pm

    the kind of people that use buses, are people who have choosen not to run a car, I live in the city and work in the city, I dont need to use a car, as everything is linked up by the publiic transport the government is trying to get people on.
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    TuppenceHapenny
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    Re: Rail prices rise by more than fifty percent.

    Post by TuppenceHapenny on Mon 31 Dec 2012, 2:46 pm

    How about double income families with one car? I would KILL for a bus to take me where I need to go. I am so bloody sick of driving If it were possible I would never get behind the wheel of another vehicle. YUCK!
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    papa_umau
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    Re: Rail prices rise by more than fifty percent.

    Post by papa_umau on Wed 02 Jan 2013, 12:51 pm

    bowsertoad wrote:the kind of people that use buses, are people who have choosen not to run a car, I live in the city and work in the city, I dont need to use a car, as everything is linked up by the publiic transport the government is trying to get people on.

    Of course you are right Bowsie, as not only the poor use buses. The thing is that with the cost of public transport rising inexorably day after day, the people that WOULD use buses to commute to and from work with are now being actively - because of the high cost - driven away, ( excuse the pun ), from this choice in transportation.

    Of course there is also the consideration that buses, rather than trains - in most cases - take us closer to our place of work and that too is another of the considerations that help us to decide whether we should use them or not.

    With this thought in mind, it is not hard to decide that we might find that using a car to get to our place of work is more convenient than a bus or train as it is warm, private, and gets us - usually - right from the door, to the door, that we need.

    If the government REALLY want us to use public transport they are going to have to take all these points into consideration.

    TuppenceHapenny wrote:How about double income families with one car? I would KILL for a bus to take me where I need to go. I am so bloody sick of driving If it were possible I would never get behind the wheel of another vehicle. YUCK!
    Tuppence

    Yes, Tuppence, it is true that now that both partners in any relationship now need to work to subsist it is also true that - at least in Britain - this means that two-car families are now the norm instead of one partner staying at home - for whatever reasons.

    I am also aware that public bus services in America are just not as common or available as they are in Britain and that is one of the reasons that it should actually be easier for our government to get us to use them more often here.

    Because we, here, are being priced out of using buses and trains, this means that the roads and streets are being more and more congested by cars that might not necessarily be used if the cost-comparison between cars and buses was better here.

    Oh and.... as I see it, from over here across the pond, you also have another level of transport that we do not; namely, the relatively-cheap taxi.

    In Britain, while taxis are not as ubiquitous as they are in America - it seems - that they are also at least three times more expensive than the already-expensive buses and trains are. This cuts down on the choices of public transport that we have to use over here.


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    Rail Fares

    Post by Technician on Thu 03 Jan 2013, 11:30 am

    Hi All,

    Fistly, this is wishing you all a very happy new year, hope you all have a good one !

    Now Paps ( and the other erudite contributors !) I can only agree 100%. The SCANDAL (for that is what it is) of UK train fares is a national disgrace. Unfortunately because we are told that there are more and more people wishing to travel then they have almost a captive audeince. They can increase fares as much as possible and we will keep paying.

    As for money needed for investment; then very little of it goes that way, as most goes into the pockets of the train companies ( in fact the ' financial formula' for compensating these companies is both complex and ludiicrous, but just typical of the Dep for Transport).

    In fact following the franchise cock up the taxpayer ( who is the one that ultimately pays ,) will be shafted yet again for the incompetence and arrogance in implementing the government franchise process. To top it all read the sheer cheek of this minister:

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2255736/Rail-fares-Britains-got-premium-service-Rail-min

    just got my blood boiling !!!

    Just looked up the train fare from London the Manchester (peak period, standard: Just over 300 !!!). I would rather crawl the distance on broken glass wearing a hair shirt than pay those bandidts!!!!

    Technician
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    papa_umau
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    Re: Rail prices rise by more than fifty percent.

    Post by papa_umau on Thu 03 Jan 2013, 11:49 am

    Yeah Technician, that minister has certainly got a cheek trying to tell us that we have a "premium" service on the rails.

    You touched on EXACTLY the point that is, or should be, winding up the regular rail-users: As around fifty percent of what goes into the TOCs and Network-Rail comes directly from government subsidy, it is outrageous that these subsidies should be increasing the profits of the TOCs and lining the pockets of the rail-company's shareholders instead of being guaranteed to create a better and cheaper service.

    When we consider that any nationalised service would not get much more subsidy than the private companies already get surely it must be a consideration that these rail-services COULD be re-nationalised at some time in the future.

    We already have many successfully working models that work that way which we could copy in France and Germany and I have no clue about why we do not do this.


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    Re: Rail prices rise by more than fifty percent.

    Post by Guest on Sat 05 Jan 2013, 9:16 am

    Rail transport is uneconomical and will continue to be so. Running a separate network to the roads and then using it once every 20 minutes makes no economic sense whatsoever. The sooner the government stops wasting taxpayers money subsidising this ridiculous carry-on the better.

    Tarmac over the tracks and sell the space to all comers. If you want cheap transport go by coach.

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    papa_umau
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    Re: Rail prices rise by more than fifty percent.

    Post by papa_umau on Sat 05 Jan 2013, 12:55 pm

    That is a typically Clapco-esque statement that I am not one bit surprised about.

    Of course, back here in the real world those of us that have brains KNOW that the railways are just as essential to the daily life of individuals, businesspeople, and companies as cars and lorries are. In fact many people who do know would transfer much more of the commercial trade off the roads and onto the rails if they could find a good and cheap way to do it.

    As I already said.......( I do repeat myself quite a lot here ); why don't we pick the brains of the designers of many of the railway-systems that work very successfully in and around the European states as what they do and how they do it could also work very well in Britain.

    It is also not one bit surprising that many of the railway systems in Europe are still publicly owned and run and the only main difference with them and what we used to have for a public rail system was that theirs were and are better managed and financed than ours ever were or probably ever will be.

    A recent TV programme that I have been watching avidly is one where Michael Portillo, the ex Tory Minister, has reported on what he entitles "Great Continental Railway Journeys". He has narrated his journey throughout Europe as he follows George Bradshaw's Edwardian book of rail journeys. Find out more about this programme HERE.

    One thing that has come across in this great travelogue is just how different each set of journeys is as different countries deal with how they get their own people and tourists around their countries. The railway-system that impressed me the best, ( a fully nationalised system ), was the one that the Swiss built and run all around the mountains of that very mountainous country.

    Oh yes, we have a great lot to learn from how they do this on the continent, which could be applied here. The greatest point of all of this is that in the main very few of these great railways on the European continent are run by the privateers.


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