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    THATCHER CHANGED BRITAIN FOR THE WORST.

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    THATCHER CHANGED BRITAIN FOR THE WORST.

    Post by Parliament.... on Sun 26 Jun 2011, 12:49 pm

    The very fact that Milliband now wants to take Labour in a different direction says much about the British people.

    Through the Thatcher Major, years, millions of British people were made poor as a matter of policy, while others got rich as a matter of policy.

    Blair and Brown embraced Thatcherism due to the change in the British, and now Milliband wants to change Labour again due to a changed Britain.

    I personally long for a political party that sticks to it's core values, that has conviction, that does not change itself to suit a greedy selfish uncaring British populas who'se only thought is "self". In my view this "self is mainly among the British middle classes.

    Thatcher changed Britain for the worse, and now we are repeaping through this dreadful coalition, what she has sown.
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    Re: THATCHER CHANGED BRITAIN FOR THE WORST.

    Post by papa_umau on Sun 26 Jun 2011, 1:48 pm

    While it is not going to do your credibility any good by constantly hammering at that old nut, I do have to say that while we must remember what has went before we have to be willing to change in order that we can IMPROVE.

    A wise old sage once said that: "the only thing constant in life is CHANGE as change is constant !". Another wise saying was: "If we do not learn from our mistakes we are bound to repeat them !"

    That is why I work so hard at trying to learn from these "mistakes" as I for one do want to improve how I live and do want to support the ones that are also willing to change and improve.

    While saying that I am willing to admit that not all change is good change and even here we have to watch what is going on so that we do not get too far off track.


    Last edited by papa_umau on Mon 27 Jun 2011, 12:50 pm; edited 1 time in total


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    Re: THATCHER CHANGED BRITAIN FOR THE WORST.

    Post by Parliament.... on Sun 26 Jun 2011, 3:57 pm

    papa_umau wrote:While it is not going to do your credibility an good by constantly hammering at that old nut, I do have to say that while we must remember what has went before we have to be willing to change in order that we can IMPROVE.

    A wise old sage once said that: "the only thing constant in life is CHANGE as change is constant !". Another wise saying was: "If we do not learn from our mistakes we are bound to repeat them !"

    That is why I work so hard at trying to learn from these "mistakes" as I for one do want to improve how I live and do want to support the ones that are also willing to change and improve.

    While saying that I am willing to admit that not all change is good change and even here we have to watch what is going on so that we do not get too far off track.

    What "mistakes" are you refering to Pap ?

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    Re: THATCHER CHANGED BRITAIN FOR THE WORST.

    Post by Parliament.... on Sun 26 Jun 2011, 4:00 pm

    papa_umau wrote:While it is not going to do your credibility an good by constantly hammering at that old nut, I do have to say that while we must remember what has went before we have to be willing to change in order that we can IMPROVE.

    A wise old sage once said that: "the only thing constant in life is CHANGE as change is constant !". Another wise saying was: "If we do not learn from our mistakes we are bound to repeat them !"

    That is why I work so hard at trying to learn from these "mistakes" as I for one do want to improve how I live and do want to support the ones that are also willing to change and improve.

    While saying that I am willing to admit that not all change is good change and even here we have to watch what is going on so that we do not get too far off track.

    Pap,

    The only real change that Milliband could achieve for the positive side of Britain, is by himself taking us fully into the EU and adopting the Euro.
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    Re: THATCHER CHANGED BRITAIN FOR THE WORST.

    Post by papa_umau on Mon 27 Jun 2011, 1:03 pm

    Ivanhoe said...and I quote:

    What "mistakes" are you refering to Pap ?

    The "mistakes" I talk of are far too many in number to dredge up here. All we have to do to be able to learn from them is by starting to admit them.

    AND....

    The only real change that Milliband could achieve for the positive side of Britain, is by himself taking us fully into the EU and adopting the Euro.

    Sorry Ivanhoe, but I do not think that you have any clue what is in Ed Miliband's mind as I do not think you have studied him or his policies closely enough.

    As I said elsewhere....Ed Miliband is treading a very narrow path at the moment as he is trying very hard not to antagonise all of the converts that Blair brought over from the right wing. He is trying very hard to use Blair's methods without hammering too hard on his lefty ways of thinking. All that aside he IS a lefty, just like his father was. His brother David is a true Blairite - and we don't really want to go down that path again do we ?

    See THIS.


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    Re: THATCHER CHANGED BRITAIN FOR THE WORST.

    Post by jim on Mon 27 Jun 2011, 3:58 pm

    Margaret Thatcher's use of the fashion accessory gave rise to the phrase "hand-bagging". One of her infamous bags is expected to raise £100,000 at an auction.

    Are you going to bid Ivanhoe Laughing
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    Re: THATCHER CHANGED BRITAIN FOR THE WORST.

    Post by papa_umau on Tue 28 Jun 2011, 11:53 am

    While Ivanhoe and I agree that Thatcher did do a serious lot of harm to Britain while she was ramming her policies down our throats, we disagree about the person herself. I have always admired her for her tenacity and her application of power and while I never agreed with her ideas or her methods I had to grudgingly admire her "Iron Lady" persona.

    She is/was so hard right-wing that it does us good to know her well and recognise her for what she was....a dictator in her party. As with all dictators, as soon as she became a liability her own party turned on her, took her lead-lined hand-bag away from her and threw her into political oblivion.


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    Re: THATCHER CHANGED BRITAIN FOR THE WORST.

    Post by Parliament.... on Tue 28 Jun 2011, 12:24 pm

    papa_umau wrote:While Ivanhoe and I agree that Thatcher did do a serious lot of harm to Britain while she was ramming her policies down our throats, we disagree about the person herself. I have always admired her for her tenacity and her application of power and while I never agreed with her ideas or her methods I had to grudgingly admire her "Iron Lady" persona.

    She is/was so hard right-wing that it does us good to know her well and recognise her for what she was....a dictator in her party. As with all dictators, as soon as she became a liability her own party turned on her, took her lead-lined hand-bag away from her and threw her into political oblivion.

    Oh dear Pap, when it comes to "iron leaders" you could say that despite his nausiating principles and barbaric ideas, that you also admired Hitler.

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    Re: THATCHER CHANGED BRITAIN FOR THE WORST.

    Post by Parliament.... on Tue 28 Jun 2011, 1:09 pm

    papa_umau wrote:While Ivanhoe and I agree that Thatcher did do a serious lot of harm to Britain while she was ramming her policies down our throats, we disagree about the person herself. I have always admired her for her tenacity and her application of power and while I never agreed with her ideas or her methods I had to grudgingly admire her "Iron Lady" persona.

    She is/was so hard right-wing that it does us good to know her well and recognise her for what she was....a dictator in her party. As with all dictators, as soon as she became a liability her own party turned on her, took her lead-lined hand-bag away from her and threw her into political oblivion.

    Pap, I have nothing but utter contempt for Thatcher and her pathetic supports. It was and is the easist thing in the world to pertain to greed and self interest, while clobbering the ill, the old, the poor, and the unemployed, whilst creating as such.

    May Thatcher rot in hell.

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    Re: THATCHER CHANGED BRITAIN FOR THE WORST.

    Post by papa_umau on Wed 29 Jun 2011, 11:18 am

    "Grudgingly admire!" were my words as I have always believed that there is some good in the worst of us. And YES, I will admit that there were a few of even Hitler's qualities that I again "grudgingly" admired too. Both of these people had the ability to draw whole countries to their visions of how these countries should be organised and run and it is now only with hindsight that we know just how selfish and uncaring and cruel both of these people actually were.

    Having said these words, that does not mean that I admired them for their policies or their humanities as both of them were in fact very poor humans.

    Rather than hating these people, as I believe that hatred achieves nothing, I am firmly of the opinion that we should know them as well as we can so that we can avoid what they did wrong when they were in power.

    As my wise ole Irish gran used to say: "Keep your friends close but keep your enemies even closer !"


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    Re: THATCHER CHANGED BRITAIN FOR THE WORST.

    Post by Parliament.... on Wed 29 Jun 2011, 11:25 am

    papa_umau wrote:"Grudgingly admire!" were my words as I have always believed that there is some good in the worst of us. And YES, I will admit that there were a few of even Hitler's qualities that I again "grudgingly" admired too. Both of these people had the ability to draw whole countries to their visions of how these countries should be organised and run and it is now only with hindsight that we know just how selfish and uncaring and cruel both of these people actually were.

    Having said these words, that does not mean that I admired them for their policies or their humanities as both of them were in fact very poor humans.

    Rather than hating these people, as I believe that hatred achieves nothing, I am firmly of the opinion that we should know them as well as we can so that we can avoid what they did wrong when they were in power.

    As my wise ole Irish gran used to say: "Keep your friends close but keep your enemies even closer !"

    Pap, "It was'nt so much that Sgt Bilko was clever, it was that his men were so blasted stupid".

    No offence intended toward yourself.
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    Re: THATCHER CHANGED BRITAIN FOR THE WORST.

    Post by Hell's Granny on Mon 04 Jul 2011, 5:48 pm

    I remember in the 1970's, when I was a Student Nurse, there was a bid to have Medical and Educational Staff salaries increased, as they had fallen badly behind the other professions.

    Both Enoch Powell and Barbara Castle said that nursing staff should not be given any increase as nursing was a 'Vocation. Both of these august persons were Labour Ministers, and Labour was in power at the time. When I qualified, many newly qualified nursing personnel were made redundant, myself included, by that same Labour Government.

    I no longer vote labour automatically, as my parents did, I prefer to go by Manifesto, but these days, there is little or nothing to choose between them. I always vote, as my Grandmother was a Suffragette, and she and others protested, suffered jail terms, and one died for my right to vote.

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    Re: THATCHER CHANGED BRITAIN FOR THE WORST.

    Post by Parliament.... on Mon 04 Jul 2011, 10:54 pm

    Hell's Granny wrote:I remember in the 1970's, when I was a Student Nurse, there was a bid to have Medical and Educational Staff salaries increased, as they had fallen badly behind the other professions.

    Both Enoch Powell and Barbara Castle said that nursing staff should not be given any increase as nursing was a 'Vocation. Both of these august persons were Labour Ministers, and Labour was in power at the time. When I qualified, many newly qualified nursing personnel were made redundant, myself included, by that same Labour Government.

    I no longer vote labour automatically, as my parents did, I prefer to go by Manifesto, but these days, there is little or nothing to choose between them. I always vote, as my Grandmother was a Suffragette, and she and others protested, suffered jail terms, and one died for my right to vote.

    The difference is that the Tory right wing create unemployment deliberately as a matter of policy, as an inflationary tool.
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    Re: THATCHER CHANGED BRITAIN FOR THE WORST.

    Post by papa_umau on Tue 05 Jul 2011, 11:47 am

    Hell's Granny wrote:I remember in the 1970's, when I was a Student Nurse, there was a bid to have Medical and Educational Staff salaries increased, as they had fallen badly behind the other professions.

    Both Enoch Powell and Barbara Castle said that nursing staff should not be given any increase as nursing was a 'Vocation. Both of these august persons were Labour Ministers, and Labour was in power at the time. When I qualified, many newly qualified nursing personnel were made redundant, myself included, by that same Labour Government.

    I no longer vote labour automatically, as my parents did, I prefer to go by Manifesto, but these days, there is little or nothing to choose between them. I always vote, as my Grandmother was a Suffragette, and she and others protested, suffered jail terms, and one died for my right to vote.

    Yes HG, I can easily understand why you might think - and be displeased - that because nursing is a "vocation", "they" ( the government - any government ), might think that because it is a vocation you don't need to be paid the wages that gives you a decent living standard. That is a very below-the-belt attack as it might be inclined to make such nurses feel uncomfortable about fighting for decent treatment in their workplace.

    That is a VERY old trick and even so it is still one that is mean-spirited and psychologically, simply a form of spiritual blackmail.

    I am in the same position as you are as far as voting Labour is concerned as all of my English family - especially my beloved grandad - were "old-Labour" in their views.

    I too like to see what is in the manifestos before I make up my mind who to vote for, but even so I do feel that the intellectual history of certain parties does attract me more in the Labour form than it does in the Tory form as when all is said and done, left is still left and right is still right and I cannot give my allegiance to anything that is right-wing in policy. Maybe that is wrong, but I cannot help that the feelings that are in my heart for the people who care about the people cannot be denied.


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    Re: THATCHER CHANGED BRITAIN FOR THE WORST.

    Post by Parliament.... on Tue 05 Jul 2011, 3:51 pm

    papa_umau wrote:
    Hell's Granny wrote:I remember in the 1970's, when I was a Student Nurse, there was a bid to have Medical and Educational Staff salaries increased, as they had fallen badly behind the other professions.

    Both Enoch Powell and Barbara Castle said that nursing staff should not be given any increase as nursing was a 'Vocation. Both of these august persons were Labour Ministers, and Labour was in power at the time. When I qualified, many newly qualified nursing personnel were made redundant, myself included, by that same Labour Government.

    I no longer vote labour automatically, as my parents did, I prefer to go by Manifesto, but these days, there is little or nothing to choose between them. I always vote, as my Grandmother was a Suffragette, and she and others protested, suffered jail terms, and one died for my right to vote.

    Yes HG, I can easily understand why you might think - and be displeased - that because nursing is a "vocation", "they" ( the government - any government ), might think that because it is a vocation you don't need to be paid the wages that gives you a decent living standard. That is a very below-the-belt attack as it might be inclined to make such nurses feel uncomfortable about fighting for decent treatment in their workplace.

    That is a VERY old trick and even so it is still one that is mean-spirited and psychologically, simply a form of spiritual blackmail.

    I am in the same position as you are as far as voting Labour is concerned as all of my English family - especially my beloved grandad - were "old-Labour" in their views.

    I too like to see what is in the manifestos before I make up my mind who to vote for, but even so I do feel that the intellectual history of certain parties does attract me more in the Labour form than it does in the Tory form as when all is said and done, left is still left and right is still right and I cannot give my allegiance to anything that is right-wing in policy. Maybe that is wrong, but I cannot help that the feelings that are in my heart for the people who care about the people cannot be denied.

    Very well put Pap, but it is only since the 80's that the Tory right wing has emerged, including under New Labour, before the 80's we had decent one nation left of centre small C Conservative, and equally decent left wing Labour Government's, and much better and fairer Britain

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    Re: THATCHER CHANGED BRITAIN FOR THE WORST.

    Post by papa_umau on Wed 06 Jul 2011, 11:49 am

    Sorry Ivanhoe, but I cannot agree with you there as, as far as I can see, "right wing" was always right wing and the Tories have ALWAYS been right wing if not actually fascist in their thinking. What I will say is that for many years when the Tories lost their first election fight after the second world war - and after Churchill's jingoistic following died down a bit - The Tories came back in a much more acceptable form. They worked very hard to look like a progressive form of the Labour party of these times but underneath this web of deceit was a very strong river of hard-right thinking.

    That is why I believe that the Tory party, in any of it's guises, is always a dangerous form of politics wherever and whenever it appears. They simply cannot be trusted with the care of the social structure of Britain as they always think of their own needs first, second and last.


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    Re: THATCHER CHANGED BRITAIN FOR THE WORST.

    Post by Parliament.... on Wed 06 Jul 2011, 1:02 pm

    papa_umau wrote:Sorry Ivanhoe, but I cannot agree with you there as, as far as I can see, "right wing" was always right wing and the Tories have ALWAYS been right wing if not actually fascist in their thinking. What I will say is that for many years when the Tories lost their first election fight after the second world war - and after Churchill's jingoistic following died down a bit - The Tories came back in a much more acceptable form. They worked very hard to look like a progressive form of the Labour party of these times but underneath this web of deceit was a very strong river of hard-right thinking.

    That is why I believe that the Tory party, in any of it's guises, is always a dangerous form of politics wherever and whenever it appears. They simply cannot be trusted with the care of the social structure of Britain as they always think of their own needs first, second and last.

    Pap, When Thatcher took office she took what was a decent one nation small "c" left of centra Conservative party and took it to the right, there is no doubt at this.

    This is what I know. The late Ted Heath was more to the left, than Tony Blair.
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    Re: THATCHER CHANGED BRITAIN FOR THE WORST.

    Post by papa_umau on Wed 06 Jul 2011, 5:35 pm

    Sorry again Ivanhoe, BUT....all Thatcher did was show the true worth of the Tories as she was not afraid to come right out and say what she stood for. That is another reason why I admire her ways if not her policies.

    Believe me, the Tory party have been full of hard right wingers for many years, they just did not want to publicly show that they were very close to being fascists. Poor ole Edward Heath was a puppet and the acceptable face of Toryism as were the other five leaders of the Tory party that I often talk about.

    The Tories have been practicing "the acceptable face of Toryism" for many years simply because the great majority of the voters in Britain have been left-of-centre since the war years. In fact, there was a dark few years in Britain when a great many of the Labourites were in fact Communists, as can still be seen in the history of the unions in the shipbuilding, mining and heavy engineering sectors.

    Now everybody, starting with Tony Blair, were trying to appeal to the middle England and middle regions voters by trying to be "all things to all men". Of course, any person that has his or her eyes open can see EXACTLY what is going on here.

    Maggie Thatcher was instrumental in causing the destruction of all of the industries that were heavily based in Communism right up and down the country and that is why she could never say that she was "middle-of-the-road" in her political philosophy. Now that she has been usurped by her own people the Tory party can get down to work trying to appeal to the middle-England voters once again.

    David Cameron is exactly the person that is where he is for that exact reason. Just do not think that because he sounds like the proverbial acceptable face of Toryism that he actually is. He is a dyed-in-the-wool Thatcherite and a hard-right-winger for all of his plausibility.

    THAT....my friend, is the true story about what has been going on in Britain in politics since the second world war.

    Rant over...but it was good to get that off my chest ! Twisted Evil


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    Re: THATCHER CHANGED BRITAIN FOR THE WORST.

    Post by Parliament.... on Wed 06 Jul 2011, 8:49 pm

    papa_umau wrote:Sorry again Ivanhoe, BUT....all Thatcher did was show the true worth of the Tories as she was not afraid to come right out and say what she stood for. That is another reason why I admire her ways if not her policies.

    Believe me, the Tory party have been full of hard right wingers for many years, they just did not want to publicly show that they were very close to being fascists. Poor ole Edward Heath was a puppet and the acceptable face of Toryism as were the other five leaders of the Tory party that I often talk about.

    The Tories have been practicing "the acceptable face of Toryism" for many years simply because the great majority of the voters in Britain have been left-of-centre since the war years. In fact, there was a dark few years in Britain when a great many of the Labourites were in fact Communists, as can still be seen in the history of the unions in the shipbuilding, mining and heavy engineering sectors.

    Now everybody, starting with Tony Blair, were trying to appeal to the middle England and middle regions voters by trying to be "all things to all men". Of course, any person that has his or her eyes open can see EXACTLY what is going on here.

    Maggie Thatcher was instrumental in causing the destruction of all of the industries that were heavily based in Communism right up and down the country and that is why she could never say that she was "middle-of-the-road" in her political philosophy. Now that she has been usurped by her own people the Tory party can get down to work trying to appeal to the middle-England voters once again.

    David Cameron is exactly the person that is where he is for that exact reason. Just do not think that because he sounds like the proverbial acceptable face of Toryism that he actually is. He is a dyed-in-the-wool Thatcherite and a hard-right-winger for all of his plausibility.

    THAT....my friend, is the true story about what has been going on in Britain in politics since the second world war.

    Rant over...but it was good to get that off my chest ! Twisted Evil

    Pap, Would you say you were more Communist, than Socialist ?
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    Re: THATCHER CHANGED BRITAIN FOR THE WORST.

    Post by papa_umau on Thu 07 Jul 2011, 12:30 pm

    A VERY good question Ivanhoe !

    I have been interested in Marxism for many years and the teachings I received at the knee of my Old-Labour grandfather certainly pointed me in a specific direction.

    That said, as I have watched what went on in the Soviet bloc and it's satellites before and after it's collapse I really cannot easily embrace Communism as it is far too set in far-left dogma for me to support.

    As I have said many times here, "I DEPLORE extremism in any form" and there is no doubt that pure Communism is based on some very extreme rhetoric.

    Curiously, I am now a fully-committed atheist, ( as was the core of the Communist faithful ), but that does not mean that because I embrace atheism that I am also a Communist as nothing could be further from the truth.

    You have made me think deeply bacuse of your question and I have decided that the true centre-left is the place that I should be and I also believe that taking the best out of the Old-Labour way is the way that I would like to see politics in Britain go in the future.

    Yes, I too am aiming for the centre-ground but my "centre-ground" is solidy set in the Old-Labour values supported by some of the best of the Marxist values too.

    The French revolution - although like the Bolshevic revolution, was a bloody affair - it seems to have most of what I am looking for in a political philosphy. Their motto of "Liberté, égalité, fraternité" - in my estimation - holds many of the wishes and desires of a truly free Britain.

    Yes Ivanhoe, I am a very queer fish !


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    Re: THATCHER CHANGED BRITAIN FOR THE WORST.

    Post by Parliament.... on Thu 07 Jul 2011, 1:13 pm

    papa_umau wrote:A VERY good question Ivanhoe !

    I have been interested in Marxism for many years and the teachings I received at the knee of my Old-Labour grandfather certainly pointed me in a specific direction.

    That said, as I have watched what went on in the Soviet bloc and it's satellites before and after it's collapse I really cannot easily embrace Communism as it is far too set in far-left dogma for me to support.

    As I have said many times here, "I DEPLORE extremism in any form" and there is no doubt that pure Communism is based on some very extreme rhetoric.

    Curiously, I am now a fully-committed atheist, ( as was the core of the Communist faithful ), but that does not mean that because I embrace atheism that I am also a Communist as nothing could be further from the truth.

    You have made me think deeply bacuse of your question and I have decided that the true centre-left is the place that I should be and I also believe that taking the best out of the Old-Labour way is the way that I would like to see politics in Britain go in the future.

    Yes, I too am aiming for the centre-ground but my "centre-ground" is solidy set in the Old-Labour values supported by some of the best of the Marxist values too.

    The French revolution - although like the Bolshevic revolution, was a bloody affair - it seems to have most of what I am looking for in a political philosphy. Their motto of "Liberté, égalité, fraternité" - in my estimation - holds many of the wishes and desires of a truly free Britain.

    Yes Ivanhoe, I am a very queer fish !

    What you are Pap, is a decent and intelligent man.
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    Re: THATCHER CHANGED BRITAIN FOR THE WORST.

    Post by Shuggy on Thu 07 Jul 2011, 10:42 pm

    Just who were the left wing labour party party?????? The way I sure it they were doing what they were told by their union pay masters. Things went terribly wrong when union leaders started getting to big for their boots and started using their members as weapons against who ever was in power. They brought down one party and bragged they could do the same with Margaret Thatcher. Scargill made a big mistake when he TOLD the Notts coal field workers with out a ballet to strike. Which split his membership down the middle. This allowed Margaret Thatcher to take controll. She made sure the unions couldn't regain the power they once had.
    We the people kicked out Conservatives and expected a middle of the road labour to run the country. Just why Blair stayed in power for so long is beyond me, we may as well have left the conservative in power. Blair was happy with what Margaret Thatcher had left him. At least MT ran under a right wing flag, Blair did the same under left wing flag but we kept him in power but why? he certainly wasn't LABOUR.

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    Re: THATCHER CHANGED BRITAIN FOR THE WORST.

    Post by Parliament.... on Fri 08 Jul 2011, 10:22 am

    Shuggy wrote:Just who were the left wing labour party party?????? The way I sure it they were doing what they were told by their union pay masters. Things went terribly wrong when union leaders started getting to big for their boots and started using their members as weapons against who ever was in power. They brought down one party and bragged they could do the same with Margaret Thatcher. Scargill made a big mistake when he TOLD the Notts coal field workers with out a ballet to strike. Which split his membership down the middle. This allowed Margaret Thatcher to take controll. She made sure the unions couldn't regain the power they once had.
    We the people kicked out Conservatives and expected a middle of the road labour to run the country. Just why Blair stayed in power for so long is beyond me, we may as well have left the conservative in power. Blair was happy with what Margaret Thatcher had left him. At least MT ran under a right wing flag, Blair did the same under left wing flag but we kept him in power but why? he certainly wasn't LABOUR.

    All Labour party's prior to 1979 and the Thatcher era were left wing Labour. However because the right wing Tory's were in government for almost 20 years, "tradional" Labour with it's core left wing values were unelectasble, even though those left wing core values encompasssed policies that were for all the people and not just vthe rich.

    So Neil Kinncck took it upon himself to change Labour to suit modern times, and so following the death of the late John Smith, Tony Blair was elected Labour leader and Mr Blair then continued Neil Kinnock's changes and so Tony Blair and Gordon Brown embraced Thatcher's right wing policies encompassed in the free market.

    Arthur Scargill knew what the right wing Tory's were capable of, but the British being largely policically inept believed the Murdoch press, and the rest is history.
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    Re: THATCHER CHANGED BRITAIN FOR THE WORST.

    Post by papa_umau on Fri 08 Jul 2011, 12:08 pm

    Yes guys I think that it is good for us to recognise that the Labour party has changed many times and in many ways over the years. After the war it was mostly controlled by the Communists that were left over from the war and slowly - both by the influences imposed under Thatcher and the influences imposed by Blair - the party changed dramatically to a centre-left party. I would even say that at the end of Blair's reign the Labour party had become more centre-right than centre-left so that it could appeal to as many disenchanted ex-Tory voters as it could.

    This, in fact, just succeeded in the Labour party losing its way and becoming some kind of ersatz Tory party and right-leaning government.

    I think and hope that under the leadership of Ed Miliband the Labour party will move again back to the middle-left and many of the best policies - and none of the bad policies - of Old-Labour will come back to help out the beleaguered centre-ground and the bottom end of British society.


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    Re: THATCHER CHANGED BRITAIN FOR THE WORST.

    Post by Parliament.... on Fri 08 Jul 2011, 12:20 pm

    papa_umau wrote:Yes guys I think that it is good for us to recognise that the Labour party has changed many times and in many ways over the years. After the war it was mostly controlled by the Communists that were left over from the war and slowly - both by the influences imposed under Thatcher and the influences imposed by Blair - the party changed dramatically to a centre-left party. I would even say that at the end of Blair's reign the Labour party had become more centre-right than centre-left so that it could appeal to as many disenchanted ex-Tory voters as it could.

    This, in fact, just succeeded in the Labour party losing its way and becoming some kind of ersatz Tory party and right-leaning government.

    I think and hope that under the leadership of Ed Miliband the Labour party will move again back to the middle-left and many of the best policies - and none of the bad policies - of Old-Labour will come back to help out the beleaguered centre-ground and the bottom end of British society.

    Pap, are you saying that Clemm Attlee, Nye Bevon, and Earnest Bevon were Communists, other than Labour left wing ?

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